WA Family Law and Separation - Where to Start?

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babyfirst

Well-Known Member
25 March 2016
21
1
124
Everyone says just move out see a lawyer and go to court; it will sort itself out.

These people haven't been in my situation. They're not thinking through all the logistics.

They say if she picks up your daughter, just call the police. This doesn't necessarily work and wrong a policeman / woman on a wrong day will believe I am a monster and hand daughter over to my partner.

People say just show all history of medications to courts. (I have medicare print out of meds in last 4 years. They are astounding. Over 1000 pills a month all of the narcotic type nation.) Then I think, yes I've got it covered and I'll win custody or daughter.

Wrong again. The courts see this and many other worse situations every day. They might just look at in a way of 'OK she got in the trap of prescription meds and over did it' not a problem, put a treatment plan in place and some parenting help. Will get daughter with Mum and dad can see her every second weekend.

This would be catastrophic. My daughter fears being with her mother. Any separation from me would cause considerable distress to her and would damage her if prolonged.

I have to show the court all other evidence and even then who knows.

This is also why I'm still here after 3 years. I'm petrified of it going wrong. At least, at the moment, I know I can keep my daughter safe and happy although this is a huge stress for me.

I dance around my partner, give her money, anything just to keep her happy. I don't confront her, when she's going off and I can't stop it. I whisk my daughter into the car without making a big deal out of it and say "come on, off to the park."

My daughter had remained largely unaffected.

We do all sorts of activities, go to other children's birthday parties, visit aunties and uncles every weekend. Go shopping, on boat rides to water parks. The works. All without mum as she's out or asleep.

My daughter rarely interacts with her mother so has been unaffected so far. This will change as she gets older.

Sorry venting more than anything.

So much of this situation is out of my control. Everyone thinks this is easy to fix and there isn't one.
 

babyfirst

Well-Known Member
25 March 2016
21
1
124
Nothing is easy n things will become more difficult as it progresses. Irregardless whether a partner has an addiction or not, if they r not willing or ur unable to sit down n talk things out face to face even with a mediator from Relationship Australia or another third party because she doesn't want the situation to change then as always it will be an extremely stressful n difficult time.U would be surprised if U alone went to a therapist you enquire who deals with -domestic violence, trauma, stress, relationships, how much u URSELF will benifit on a personal level n be helped mentally to think more clearly, gain knowledge of how to approach n handle ur partner but also advised how to go about this situation keeping in mind the safety of ur child at all times in getting out of the relationship n they will also support you through this including ringing around to find correct assistance, legal information, free lawyer etc. Life Line centres, Salvation Army will also support u through court n r professionally obligated to report to authorities all forms of life or risk threatening related issues.They r use to dealing with situation n much worse. Bare in mind their reports can be summoned or they can be called as a witness on ur behalf. They can guide u n help speed up the process to get ur matter heard by the court whilst at a timely moment help u obtain a AVO or/ n Restraining Order for both u n ur child n can quickly locate accommodation for u both if need be otherwise their priority would be to get her out of the house as u r the prime carer of ur child n the child is the number one priority in all this. So the consideration will be the safety,well being of the child and stability hence why remaining in familiar surroundings for the child e.g in her home with u would be the prime issue. If u think u can relocate n hide whilst still going to work without an AVO for both of u or a Restraining order then u r wrong.The mother can n will call police,have her child found,charged u with kidnapping or attempt to kidnap n other charges as well including placing u on an AVO, Restraining Order n other allegations. Or worst still have her mates search n find her daughter which wld be easy seeming all they wld have to do is follow u back from work. Police act upon complaint n r not Judge or Jury. U may say ur partner is unfit to care for her child but if she has a friend/ person who is willing to help her care for her child or appears quite capable of caring for her child, she will be given the child. Then the matter will have to be brought before the Family Court which comes under Federal Law initiated by either U or the mother n time taken to do this can be put off either by the Family Courts or ur partner can make up numerous reasons to delay the process let alone u Cld be held accountable for various charges ( all the while ur daughter is in the care of the mother n not U!)
Sammy01 idea of telling her u have to sell the house is only workable if u really do sell the house because everyone knows a person doesn't have to move out unless sold n u have already stated ur partner is a resourceful, intelligent n street smart person so doing this won't play out as planned. Selling ur house would keep ur credit rating n u can separate n leave with ur daughter with some story but again where the child is concerned u wld have to provide a stable place for her but there is no way ur partner is going to let u take her daughter,or be found, nor can she be stopped in taking her daughter from whatever place she is at, unless taught skills of communication from attending therapy on how to convince the mother that her life wld be better without the burden of caring for the child n u both can agree on her seeing or taking care of ur daughter can be agreed upon. n I can strongly state that any person who knows their partner has an addiction problem n thinks they r able to care for a child n expect the person not to take medication ( in this case) without proper adult supervision ( which u have no authority of ur own to ensure this, is just as irresponsible as the addict. I understand AVOs, Restraining Orders can seem worthless as the priece of paper they're written on n don't protect anyone or stop anyone ( been thru this myself including having a 2 year permenant DV order n even in court the perpertrator gets a slap on the risk if that when orders r broken)however, they r like the 'Tortoise and the Hare' senerio n eventually do make a difference.In court AVO's,Restraining Orders do come into account!
All the best n I hope u will share any outcomes as shared factual knowledge is better than none.

Sorry only just read this. Thank you for your help and is good hearing it. Sounds like you understand the situation.

I know I've been ranting a bit just very very stressed Just getting through one day is next to impossible some days.

Today is Easter. I wake 5am, get daughter's breakfast ready, wash clothes, clean up the mess, mostly my partner's.

Obviously, family wants to see my daughter but not my partner. I sneak out at 2pm when my partner goes out. See her family and stay until 6pm. Packing myself when I get home as my partner doesn't want me seeing her family but it's only way for my daughter to maintain contact with them.

Stay home and thankfully partner passed out on the couch, play with daughter, bath, dinner and bed. Partner is still laying there now starkers.

Tomorrow, I need to see my family. Again I need to dance around my partner who may 1. insist on coming (bad idea last time she came to family event we had to carry her out)
2. Refuse letting me take her
3. Hopefully agree be asleep or out.

She's been sleeping most of today so chances are, she'll be up all night tonight.These are the times she starts fires in the kitchen from turning all burners on full with something in pot, but then passes out.

These are the times she'll start hosing things in the backyard for no real reason but leaves 1 or even 2 hoses left running full bore.

She may be off through night driving away somewhere doing god knows what. I really hope what you're saying is true. I've already had counselling and the only real advise was get out and see a lawyer.

I hope someone can offer a way out and some form of accommodation until I get court orders, but I can't help but feel this won't be possible.

I'm in WA and there seems of be no help for males. I tried free community legal help and they turned me down. They started asking some pretty bizarre questions about how I wold intend on looking after a 3-year-old while working. I already gave them all details. Became blatantly obvious they were pretty much saying, you're the man working, so how can you be applying for custody? They have a preconceived view of how things should be.

They get a million dads coming in saying they should have primary custody and the system is geared to mould you into the outcome of the mother getting primary custody and you need to lay down and accept it. It's not all against men either. Family court in WA do some crazy stuff with women with extremely violent ex-partners and still force them to have contact, eventually unsupervised.

I know this sounds immature but I'm really starting to get this view of the whole institution.

I'm just lost at the moment.
.
 

Hope this helps

Well-Known Member
26 March 2016
116
17
414
I'm a funny every says just move out see a lawyer and go to court it will sort it self out.

These people haven't been in situation.

There not thinking through all logistics.

They say if she picks up your daughter just call police.

This doesn't necessarily work and wrong policeman / woman on wrong day will believe I am monster and hand daughter over to my partner.

People say just show all history of medications to courts. (I have medicare print out of meds in last 4 years. They are astounding. Over 1000 pills a month all of narcotic type nation.

Then I think yes I've got it covered and I'll win custody or daughter.

Wrong again. The courts see this and many other worse situations every day. They might just look at in way of 'OK she got in the trap of prescription meds and over did it' not a problem put treatment plan in place and some parenting help. Walla get daughter with Mum and dad can see her every second weekend.

This would be catastrophic. My daughter fears being with her mother. Any separation from me would cause considerable distress to she and would damage her if prolonged.

I have to show the court all other evidence and even then who knows.

This is also why I'm still here after 3 years. I'm petrified of it going wrong. Atleast at moment I know I can keep my daughter safe and happy all though is huge stress for me.

I dance around my partner give her money anything just to keep her happy. I don't confront her, when she's going off and I can't stop it I wisk my daughter into the car without making big deal out of it and say come on off to the park.

My daughter had remained largely unaffected.

We do all sorts of activities, go to other children's birthday parties, visit auntys and uncles every weekend. Go shopping, on boat rides to water parks. The works. All without mum as she's out or asleep.

My daughter rairly interacts with her mother so has been uneffected so far. This will change as she gets older.

Sorry venting more than anything.

So much of this situation is out of my control. Everyone thinks is easy fix and there isn't one.


Vent away! I'll be honest here and state it is evident in your 1st post that you endured because you love your partner and still do and this is also partly why you are hesitating out of fear of hurting the mother of your child. That's human nature.

File 1 and 4. No one can tell you how long it will take. That's a fact.

Fact 2: whether you ask for the mother to be placed into rehabilitation. Have a psychiatric assessment. Ask for her to participate in a Tripple P program with Relationship Australia. Supervised visitations. Ask for Full Custody of your daughter. Or anything else you ask for in court. You will not be given any guantees. The Judge will give all, some or none of these to you. That's a fact.

I can not stress enough that Family Law Court's number one priority is the child. The family court also realises all children have the right to spend and have contact with both parents. Sole Custody does not mean not spending time or some share care with the other parent. It simply means you will be the sole carer of the child not the only parent to have access to.

Even if a parent is imprisoned for whatever crime ( including life sentencing prisoners) can be be given contact time to see their children. 9 out of 10 family court orders whereby the child is ordered to spend time with both parents including shared custody, suffer the anguish, despair and worry for the child, especially when the child does not want to spend time with the other parent. Or comes home traumatised and upset, etc. That's a fact.

As your child is so young, court orders will continue to change as the child becomes older. The only thing you can hope for is that the mother kicks her addiction habit and takes pride and joy in the most fabulous gift and role in life of being a mother to her daughter.

If it makes you feel better, I as a woman, I have had to ring around, deal with idiot counsellors, constantly listen to ppl who know nothing about family law and anyone who does still think whatever happened to them in court will be the same in your case, which is totally wrong as you get different Judges and no one case is the same.

If it was that easy, we wouldn't need professionals and could look up legal manuals. As you have mentioned, each state is different. But federal law, especially where Family Law is concerned, is national. State laws, however, are different. I have no knowledge regarding state laws in WA, but that doesn't mean I can't research it.

I live in QLD ( wasn't born here) and the state laws, mentality of police, people let alone solicitors, Gov. Services, etc., is totally different to Southern states. But obtaining help is not easy and not knowing where to go, finding a decent solicitor, let alone a good one, especially when you are unable to pay is extremely difficult, disheartening, and being in extremely difficult situations involving children is already an emotional roller coaster and mentally you are not objective as one would be if assisting another person.


Regardless of how disgusted or draining and disheartening it is, let alone having a solicitor state you will get this, the judge will view this unfavourable or in your favour - the truth is solicitors and barristers themselves do not know the outcome nor the response of the Judge. That's the truth.

I wish I could give you a name of a ' good solicitor' in W.A. However, solicitors differ as well and you have to meet and greet or email or ring different solicitors as there are plenty who you can work out payments with, or will do it Pro Bono which is for free.

All you can do is your best. That's it.
 

sammy01

Well-Known Member
27 September 2015
5,153
721
2,894
Please read this Violence restraining orders - information

Ask yourself how much of it applies to you. None? Some? All? Your call.

I reckon some of it applies. Now read this www.oneinthree.com.au

Now if I had the time, I know I could find statistics that show the cops know that males can and are victims. Look I met a Domestic Violence Liaison Officer a few years back. She admitted that her employer refused to help men. There are no places in refuge shelters for blokes but the culture is changing and so is the training that people like her do.

Now my ex got me out of the house through an AVO. She was abusive, manipulative and controlling. And she used the AVO get a king-hit punch to start the whole divorce debacle. I think she abused the system. I don't think you're abusing the system. Clearly you live in fear of her...

Final thought - You are enabling her behaviour. You live in a crazy land where you function primarily to make her existence function. Once you get her out of the house, she won't function. She might get legal aid, but she will fail to get to the appointments or go while off her chops or do something else stupid and without you there to prop her up she will stuff up badly. Good.

So instead of running away from crazy, kick crazy out.
 

Hope this helps

Well-Known Member
26 March 2016
116
17
414
Thanks for the help.

Yea would love to do that all though she is one very tough women.

I've tried similar earlier last year.

She started calling every man and dog. People came over I didn't even know abusing me.

She said I was abusing her fancialy and she is in fear of her life every time she gets home.

Spoke to police and they said I can't throw her out. One I spoke to understood what was going on but said be very careful as your risking police taking you away if she is believed by anyone. That occassion he didn't believe her but said don't think another police officer won't.

She knows how to street fight so to speak with the system.

She won't just lay down and go away.

If I changed locks she would have her rough friends around and kick her way in. I discussed this option. Police said they couldn't charge her if she did as its her house also. It's no longer my house we are in defacto relationship with a child.

This all said I'm still going to throw your ideas around and look into more. I'm not discounting anything at moment.

There are accommodations for both men and women and as you would be taking your daughter with you, then you would be placed in a family accommodation rather than a men's only or a female only shelter or accommodation. However, all accommodation location must be kept secret and the process is that you will be appointed a person who would either pick you up or phoned at the very last minute where to go.

The first criteria is that you cannot be located within the same city, township of the perpetrator/s and not until your case is heard, will you be able to go to any place where you usually would go including work nor would your child be able to attend her normal day centre etc. This is not only for your protection, your daughter's protection but also other person's protection who May be in hiding from Domestic Violence.

Police must assist and follow up on any Domestic Violence complaint whether the person attends the station or if called out to a location ( not necessarily a place of residence nor does it have to be you . It could be a neighbour etc) and suddenly someone doesn't want to place charges or makes some excuse that he/ she didn't mean it, or that everything is ok or even deny - the police have the power to judge and observe what has gone on and charge, make arrest, etc. including false allocations, take a child out of a volatile situation etc.

You are not the only one who has come across or gone to the police regarding Domestic Violence and met a police person who gives you a hard time, smart comment, feel as if they don't believe you especially if you do not have any mark and phoning is worse. I, myself, was told by a policeman if I want to make a complaint then come down to the station. I was unable to move! Let alone drive. Had they said or I had known back then that you can request police to come over or they suggested they could send someone out then I would have said yes, please.

However, I still would not have been able to go downstairs, yell out nothing. A known person to me several more days later rang and instantly picked up that something was wrong and told me to call the police. I did and received a female police officer who asked me over the phone why am I ringing now after 10-day? Why didn't I come to the station?

Nothing much they can do and it's a waste of time especially if I have any bodily harm that could be photographed as after 10 days there would be nothing , did I go to a doctor or hospital? Have witnesses? Blah! Blah!

With an attitude ' you're a waste of time and my time! I then rang back my friend that I had phone police and what they said ( as she said she would phone police if I didn't. ) The known person to me came straight over after telling me she will take me to the police station herself and go with me. So she did!

My friend helped me through the ability to say what occurred but the most surprising thing to them and every worker at that station including the photographer was from head to toe my bruising, swelling ( no open wounds) after 10-11 days could be easily photographed from a distance. 3-4 weeks later, an interstate friend convinced me to see a doctor in-state what occurred, still swelling, nerve damage, bruising could be checked out and know I would not have thought to go to police or doctors. Didn't cross my mind and mentally still in shock. ( now nerve damage to right side of face and eye etc is permanent). And at that time, he was on a permanent 2-year DVO as they use to be called, not allowed to come near me, etc., but Family Court Orders override AVOs, DVOs so he had the 4 children at the time ( aged 1, 9, 11 n 13) but had left them to do this and I had the flu badly and was also traumatising, physically and verbally abusing them in ways that have damaged them for life. But they were too frighten to tell me or anyone.

Even to this day, the worst was sexual abuse which my eldest daughter at 17 had a mental breakdown, told a doctor. This occurred and what he also sexually done to our 1-year-old let alone our 2 sons.

So my point is this, don't give a damn what the attitude of the police are, know your rights, which is equal to any person. Plenty of men are physically, mentally, and verbally abused as women are and have the same rights and the law applies to all persons! Even police male and females are victims of abuse in relationships, as children, etc. it doesn't matter who you are. It doesn't matter what job position you're in including financially , race, age, etc.

The Law and your rights apply to and equal to everyone. The only people who have a much harder, more difficult ability to seek help, obtain Legal Advice let alone have extreme difficulties ( let alone obtain protection but still equally have them like anyone else) are people who have disabilities whereby they have difficulties verbally, physically as they can't write, get to places by themselves as they have a much harder time to get assistance, support, let alone fight for the protection and custody of their children let alone financially. Worse than this is children themselves who are experiencing domestic violence.

Unless you have either a disability that stops you verbally, physically from seeking help, assistance and care for yourself and your daughter which it appears you do not, then remember, know your rights! Don't give up! Don't be disillusioned by supposed persons whose job is to assist you, especially gov. services that give you the runaround or don't know their job nor give a hoot. It all comes down to you.

Just don't give up! You and your little daughter deserve not to be victimised by your circumstances and if your partner wants to continue pill popping that's her life. That's her choice. It definitely is not your daughter's choice nor yours. And as previously said in my post, this is just the beginning of a gut-wretching emotional and mental rollercoaster that unless you are willing to go to gov. sites and educate yourself about laws, rights , court procedures, advice as to where you can get info including printing off firms and lodging them etc., so it will give you more knowledge and understanding then you will, at least, feel more in control and you will get a fair idea of how long some processes take and also hints to get them faster through the process.

You do not have control over time nor court proceedings or outcomes. This is just the beginning. Nothing seems fast enough ever! So take it in your own stride. If you do want to stay in your home then obtain an AVO, a Restraining Order for both of you and your daughter, so she can't just pick up the child from daycare or come near her or you nor the house till it's taken to court.

If you are worried about her getting her heavy duty dudes and family on to you and causing trouble, report them all and police will advise you once you give their names, to place also an AVO or Restraining Order. This all seems over the top to you as you just want out and stay in the house with the care of your child, handled quietly without any trouble.

Well, forget that notion. Stop dreaming. Stop worrying and fearing the unknown. Face reality and facts, especially regarding the mother. Who knows ... This may be just the wake up cal your partner needs to get herself off the pill popping existence and your hope that she does will come true.

Anything is possible. The choice is yours, but please remember, the life and lifestyle you and your partner have created is not a healthy, good environment for your daughter. Be your child's hero and remove her from this unhealthy environment as you know you can do it. If not, you're equally at fault as your pill-popping partner in not providing a secure, loving , safe and healthy environment for your little innocent daughter who's depending on her Daddy as her protector and carer.

Take care of yourself and see counselling even if you have to go through 10 to get the right one who will help you stay mentally strong. You need a break. Whether by yourself or with your daughter, go rent or get a tent and camp near a beach , or wherever you can find solitude and peace of mind. Relax and mentally forget everything even if it's just for a few days.
 
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babyfirst

Well-Known Member
25 March 2016
21
1
124
Thanks, Sammy01 and hopethishelps.

Read through all and linked websites.

Also puts things in perspective hopethishelps reading your story. Sorry to hear what you went through.

I am trying and will keep trying. I spend 2 hours every night after daughter is in bed compiling all evidence and educating myself as much as I can. I'll get out of this soon. Won't give up on VRO option either.

I think I'll get an answer as to time frame for the form 1 and 4 will be heard soon. Initial hearing and interim parental orders, anyway.

I'm not so sure on housing for men in WA but will give it a go. She does have a black belt in martial arts which I haven't previously mentioned when investigating VRO. Only that to look at her now is hard to believe.

I have very good evidence on her medical history, including medication charts from hospitals. Some of this stuff is dubious if admissible and even the lawyer was surprised how I obtained them. Truth was, my partner stole them while in the hospital. God knows why. I immediately copied them along with filing away the originals away from home. Have photos of meds and scripts but recently obtained very comprehensive list from Medicare which was even a shock to me.

These only include the ones in her name. She sees at least one doctor under a false name (don't know how) but have copies of those scripts and medications also.

It's not a problem proving everything. Just the time frame and logistics to keep daughter safe, life going and wolves from the door financially. Also on how to disprove her version of events. She's already let the cat out of the bag when I hinted at a separation last year.

She stated she will destroy me financially, report me for financial and verbal abuse and controlling behaviour. That she has a mental health condition and was mislead by doctors leading to her addiction but which she is now under control. (Let her say that with the Medicare list I now have.)

I can definitely counter the financial abuse. She's getting a whole lot of money every week for personal use. Far more than most people. The controlling behaviour is simply not true and just looking through our history of texts is evident she's the one calling the shots.

Verbally abusive - again texts history points towards this being untrue. Belittles me. Says I can't afford her. Says I shouldn't talk in front of our daughter as she will copy my lisp. (I have an almost unnoticeable lisp which I was teased about when I was young) she loves using that one as she knows its effect me.

It all shows she's a bullying type character and isn't the other way round.

Anyway, thanks for all your help will keep you posted.
 

Hope this helps

Well-Known Member
26 March 2016
116
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Keep up the good work, especially all the dates when she is out of her head due to meds and aggressive towards you and your daughter, etc. My ex has a blackbelt in both karate and Taekwondo before I met him and God knows what. But I only gave you one example to help you understand that what you are experiencing re: police, finding assistance, etc. is exceptionally difficult, let alone keeping yourself and your daughter safe and away from your circumstances. We can just try.

You won't be placed in a men's shelter because you will have a child with you so you will be placed in accommodation for a family. Only men by themselves are placed within an all male accommodation house or shelter and you won't be placed within a family accommodation shared by women with a child, but a male facility with your daughter by yourself. They have to keep different cases in different places. You will be classed as 'family accomodate ' because your daughter is with you. Can't leave without her!

Hey, I had a lot of trouble with the police because his brother is high up in the police force, including with C.I.B's and the Qlds Police Commisioner spent holidays at the in-laws vineyard each year. So police were pigs, lied to me, lost the photographs that were taken on the day I told you and his brother assisted him right through. Let alone sorted out DOCS, got him off criminal charges for what he had done to me plus mire. The old saying - it's not what you know, but who you know- is very true and I had no family around me nor could anyone come round, phone etc. But enough about me.

Keep me posted. And it's a known fact that a person with a lisp is highly intelligent so I wouldnt worry about that either, though it shows how immature she is and all partners know each other's weak points in any relationship. I will be fighting soon and I have disabilities and health problems, and one of them is my speech will go on me due to stroke when mentally tired, to the point people find it hard to understand me and it can go at any moment so don't worry.

When I get the time and inner strength, I will be asking for advice, too, because of another disability due to chemo, radiation, operations, etc. is that I can only at times write by thumb only. So all I'm saying is feel good you are not disabled at all, working, physically able and capable, and just fight your hardest.

Knock on every door if you have to because out of the blue will come along a person who will assist you here and another there.You are already ahead of me but my ex is classed as a psychopath, sociopath ( there's a difference) , narristic, pathological liar, klempamanic and a highly intelligent one that I have taught detectives ways. They could not figure out how a certain person was able to steal in different methods let alone other things. Slit of sociopaths about but psychopaths. Only 1% of population and he's a master mind.

I've been separated for 16 years and he told me what would happen if I left him. Nor has he given up. But I'm a mother - mothers don't give up and let me tell you, it has nearly broken me. So please stay strong. Keep doing what you are doing regardless of her threats.

So long as she doesn't touch or say, do anything to your little baby girl as she is completely helpless and must be kept in your protective hand and not at the mercy of a woman who is not in control of herself. You are stronger than you realise. But as I have said, vent away!

Find a counsellor who will keep you mentally sharp, alert, educate you in a lot of ways including your daughter. Threats are part and parcel of control freaks and manipulating abusers.