QLD Can Grandparents See Child Even with DVO Against Father?

[Debmac]

My son and his partner separated 5 weeks ago. He was in an abusive relationship. The abuse started with verbal a few years ago then became physical in the last 12 months or so with my granddaughter witnessing everything.

My son moved back home and my 2 1/2-year-old granddaughter was staying here 3 days a week, but on the 10th February, the police arrived with a DVO on my son...So now he can't have any communication with her whatsoever.

He got legal advice and said he needs to do a counter-claim DVO (or cross claim), so we spent 3 days filling out forms, etc. We are waiting for her to be served...

It's been 2 1/2 weeks since we've seen her. The maternal grandmother is happy to arrange for me and hubby to pick her up for a few hours and take her home later today but we'll be taking her to my dad's place because she can't see her dad.

As my stupid ex-daughter-in-law has put my granddaughter down as child at risk, my son was the main caregiver since she was 6 months old because his ex-partner worked. Now he can't see her at all...

Does anyone know if it's OK for us to arrange with her parents to visit with the grandchild even though the maternal grandmother has to obviously ask her daughter, so she can arrange with her to pick her up, so we can collect her from the other grandmothers place?

As far as I know its not breaching the DVO.

This is heartbreaking. My son he misses her so much but we know it'll get sorted soon...With the DVO my son is putting on her, he has sworn affidavits and witnesses to her crazy outbursts of anger and constant yelling and witness to her hitting him even bashing him, whereas her DVO on him is 3/4s lies with misspelt words and sentences that don't make sense, with no witnesses or proof after anything except a few text messages.

My son has all his text messages and recorded calls of her yelling...so we're hoping she'll evoke her DVO and my son will then evoke his and then come to some arrangements until then. It's important our granddaughter doesn't think we've deserted her. Because my ex-daughter-in-law's parents work full time, she spent a lot of time here because my son was a stay at home dad.

 

[AllForHer]

So, has dad had a first hearing for the DVO yet?

 

[Debmac]

No not till march 16th

 

[sammy01]

OK, forget DVO's. Call relationships Australia.

All DVO's, AVO's should have some fine print - the fine print is that the parents can communicate for the purposes of child access...But the wording is more complex.

My thoughts? Withdraw the AVO / DVO on her. You will only make her mad. She will have the kid and she will be well upset that you have accused her of violence. How dare you. Now she might well have been violent, but so what...? Your purpose is getting time with the child, not proving she is a twit, right?

So you're gonna need to see a solicitor. Solicitor can write to her and ask her to agree to your son having the kid at particular times. Work towards that. Between here and AVO court - tell your son his job is to toughen up... Sorry but he has a long road ahead and he needs to accept that he has to be strong and do nothing stupid.

BTW AVO's are a good thing... What? Yep, see she is crazy, he has been caught up in crazy for long enough to think it is a good idea to go back, apologise accept all responsibility and wait for the next round of abuse.... (been there). So she can't contact him, he can't contact her... Good - Best thing that could have ever happened to your son.

Now he just has to learn how lucky he is to have the nutter outta his life and time to start making some long term decisions and make long term goals. Forget short term for the minute

Small steps.

 

[AllForHer]

Okay, so, a couple of things.

First, since it's a cross-application, both mum and dad will be asked how they wish to proceed with the application against them. They can accept without admissions, which means the Court will make the requested orders without any admission of guilt by the parties, or they can contest it at trial.

Contesting the application at trial is a difficult feat. The standard of evidence is on the balance of probabilities, which isn't terribly difficult to achieve, and the Court often takes a better-to-be-safe-than-sorry approach, rather than throw an application out and risk someone getting hurt down the line.

As well as the above, trial can be risky where parenting matters are concerned. An allegation that a person is violent is one thing - and that's all it remains as if the respondent accepts without admissions - but a finding from a Court that a person has been violent is another matter entirely. A finding from a Court is given a lot more weight in Family Court than just the statements of a subject party.

The other thing to consider is that this is a cross-application - neither party wants anything to do with the other, so why wouldn't the Court grant it, even at trial?

So, in my view, it's better to accept without admissions, conditional on the child being removed as a protected person on the order.

Your son is better of focusing on the more important matter of parenting orders, rather than dallying around with a DVO.

As for you as the grandparent, it may be best to wait until dad has secured some time with the child. It's best to avoid doing anything that might upset the apple cart at this stage.