VIC Form 80 - q36 - had any outstanding debts ?

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luca12

Member
19 May 2020
3
0
1
Hi Guys,
I am on a TR visa in Aus and am filling form-80 for my PR application. For question 36, in the last part, there is a question which needs to be answered in yes or no. The question is: "had any outstanding debts to the Australian Government or any public authority in Australia?

Background:
I live in VIC and received a speeding fine, speeding above 10km/hr but less than 15km/hr. Someone knowingly falsely nominated me and I applied for a rejection of nomination but due to lack of knowledge, (since I am dealing with something like this for the first time) I did not attach a stat declaration. Because of this the Traffic Camera Office did not accept my rejection and posted a letter to my address which I did not see and then after a couple of months I went overseas for a trip. On the day of my departure, the Fines Vic issued a penalty reminder notice, this had expired before my arrival to Aus. When I went to check the post after my arrival, I found the notice of final demand and all the other letters, I wasn't expecting this.
The next day, I went to Fines Vic office on Williams street and the operator told me that there is nothing I can do now since the fine is in Final Demand stage. I was baffled after listening to him, went back to my office, very distressed as I had no idea how I ended up in this situation. So, the following day I went to the Victoria Police, Traffic Camera Office. There I spoke with my case officer from admin support, she asked me to go to court for an extract to get an extension for the infringement and based on the evidence, I was granted the extension. I then applied again for a rejection of nomination, this time with a stat declaration but the Traffic Camera Office again did not accept it. The car was registered under a company and I had to provide them (Traffic Camera Office) with a retraction letter from the company which I never got. So I ended up paying the fine.

My Question:
1: Is a speeding fine in the Final Demand stage which has been paid in full by me, considered as an outstanding debt or just debt?
2: Will a National Police Check certificate, state/mention me going to magistrates court to get an extract for extension of infringement?

I will be really thankful to anyone who can help me get out of this dilemma.

Best,
Luca
 

luca12

Member
19 May 2020
3
0
1
Is any fine considered an outstanding debt ? If not, then at what stage does a fine becomes an outstanding debt ?
It just doesn't feel right to say that a fine in final demand is an outstanding debt. I reckon, when the fine is moved to enforcement warrant and when the enforcing agency eventually recovers the amount from my bank account or through any other forceful means then it should be said that it was an outstanding debt which was recovered by the state/enforcing agency. But if I have already paid it in full in the second last stage, it shouldn't be acknowledged as an outstanding debt.
I would be obliged if someone can please respond to this.

Best
Luca
 

Poidah

Well-Known Member
9 November 2017
127
4
394
Qld
So I ended up paying the fine.
If you paid the fine, why would there be an outstanding debt? Previous debts do not seem relevant to your application right?

National Police Check certificate, state/mention me going to magistrates court
Why haven't you applied for the check yet? I thought that forms part of the application for PR? Maybe wait until you receive the check before you apply?

There are also credit reports available as well to make sure that there are no outstanding debts that you may not be aware of as another option -
Credit scores and credit reports - Moneysmart.gov.au
 

luca12

Member
19 May 2020
3
0
1
Hi Poidah, Thanks for your reply.

If you paid the fine, why would there be an outstanding debt? Previous debts do not seem relevant to your application right?
I totally agree with you that the fine is no longer outstanding but the question being asked on Form 80 is, if i have ever had (could be paid in full now) any outstanding debts.
So probably I should be asking, is a fine considered an outstanding debt ? If not, then at what stage does a fine becomes an outstanding debt ?

I reckon, when the fine is moved to enforcement warrant and when the enforcing agency eventually recovers the amount from my bank account or through any other forceful means then it should be said that it was an outstanding debt which was recovered by the state/enforcing agency. But if I have already paid it in full in the second last stage, it shouldn't be acknowledged as an outstanding debt.

Why haven't you applied for the check yet? I thought that forms part of the application for PR? Maybe wait until you receive the check before you apply?
Yeah, I'll probably wait to see what it includes but people on other forums have said that it won't mention something like this since it only records convictions.

Best
Luca
 

Poidah

Well-Known Member
9 November 2017
127
4
394
Qld
if i have ever had (could be paid in full now) any outstanding debts.
There are other migration and visa discussion forums/groups around that might be able to help you out.
It does not really seem to be a matter of legality, but how the Dept has applied and investigated such issues in the past, so hearing from others would help. Australia does not seem as strict on such legalities from my understanding, the dept and philosophy tends to be far more pragmatic and direct in their application of the policy. I know in other countries, evidence of poor behaviour and social dissent will be a big consideration. Over here, it is much less of a hassle because we can evoke residency and citizenship when a serious offence happens. Australia seems far more concerned whether you can and will be a contributing taxpayer and not a massive financial burden on the system. I suspect the fines issue is more whether you still owe people or departments, or have evidence of a gambling problem. This question saves the federal dept from contacting all the state departments and local govts etc. It also allows them to revoke the visa/residency etc when they do hear from anyone later on. I haven't heard of much investigating by the fed dept across all the various govt levels and agencies.

I don't think declaring the issue upfront would be a bad thing though.
It really depends on whether you are applying with the points system, relationship visa or employer sponsored etc. I reckon if the demand for you to get in is great, you will be fine. If you are using the points system, they may just knock you down the list compared to someone without any issue? But with covid, I would think there it would be easier to get into Australia for the next couple of years rather than harder maybe? A lot of people have to leave and it is much harder to get more points, so the point bar will get lower and lower as time goes by? Stressing out about the letter of the question and twisting yourself into knots is probably not as important as getting more points and making your application more convincing probably.