WA Time with Dad Interstate - No Family Court Orders in Place?

Discussion in 'Family Law Forum' started by Breek, 9 November 2018.

  1. Breek

    Breek Member

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    I have two children, ages 13 and 12.

    Separation from the father occurred approx 7 years ago and the children have only had once weekly phone contact and face to face once a year contact.

    Father lives in VIC, we live in WA.

    Father has requested time with children for Christmas/school holidays with the children to stay with him in VIC.

    There are currently no consent orders or family court orders in place- if they go and he chooses to keep them with him, how will I have the children returned? I understand a recovery order can be requested from the court but I do not have funds to engage a solicitor.

    We also had a property settlement about 4 years ago and I was awarded indemnity costs- he has never paid- how do I recover these?
     
  2. sammy01

    sammy01 Well-Known Member

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    Not gonna like my answer. You don't want dad to do to you what you did to him?

    So let's pretend you had court orders that meant the kids are meant to go to dad this Summer. You send them. He doesn't return them. You have to go to court to have the orders enforced. So while there are some technical differences between having orders and not / the reality stays the same. Court.

    As far as property settlement what sort of $$ are you talking? How to recover? Court.
     
  3. LouiseThomas

    LouiseThomas Well-Known Member

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    I think it is your responsibility to facilitate the kids time with their father.
     
  4. Breek

    Breek Member

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    I probably should have provided more information.
    I left the marriage due to his drug use and domestic violence. He has been on and off in prison due to violence against women.

    His current partner was incarcerated for two years for meth trafficking.

    He has attempted suicide numerous times and I have facilitated the relationship with their father as safely as I am able.

    He promises he is off drugs but I still find him unpredictable and receive the occasional abusive text.

    I just don't know how comfortable I am with my children being on the other side of the country and he may not return them.
    I thought that now they are older they may be better equipped to request to return home if they felt unsafe.

    I'm doing my best to make sure he is in their lives despite the circumstances.

    Indemnity costs are 11,000.
     
  5. LouiseThomas

    LouiseThomas Well-Known Member

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    That’s a whole different ball game. Not sure what to do there when there is a risk.

    I don’t like your chances of getting the money.... you would have to take it to court unfortunately
     
  6. sammy01

    sammy01 Well-Known Member

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    If you're doing your best to make sure he is in their lives then send the kids to visit. Otherwise you are doing your best to keep him out of their lives. Simple.

    Of course you're getting the occasional abusive text. Dad wants to see his kids and you're stopping him.
    I disagree with Louise. OP has lots of excuses for not sending the kids. But none of them relate directley to the well-being of the kids. No established child abuse / neglect? not accusation, not opinion not excuses. HARD EVIDENCE police reports, Doc's interventions, impartial third party documentation relating to kids...

    Ok - so kids are 12 and 13? My situation is not entirely dis-simmilar. Although I have court orders and my kids visit the ex 8 times a yar. But if the ex witholds them even with court orders I'm still having to apply to court to have them returned. So that is the whole not sending them because without court orders arguement blown out of the water... (kinda - keep reading)

    So my ex lives in crazy land. Ex thinks that now that the eldest is 12 the child can choose to live with the ex. Ex applies pressure on 12 yr old, even going so far as to show the child the wonderful schools that the child could choose to attend. 12 yr old has expressed no desire to live with the ex and feels stressed about the pressure. I have communicated this to the ex but the ex doesn't want to hear it... So in many respects my situation is worse than your's because I have consent orders. I am compelled to send the kids and every time I worry that the eldest in particular wont be returned because the ex will claim the kid wants to stay...

    So what to do with this concern about the ex keeping the eldest and claiming that the 12 yr old wants to live with the ex? the answer? 40 cents. Little bit old school, but go with me. 40 cents that is the cost of a phone call from a phone box. They still exist. But my point is this... It is even easier these days. The kid doesn't even need 40 cents and a phone box. My 12 yr old knows how to contact me via a range of telecomunications / social media. The kids know about stranger danger and because 12 yr old has told me she is worried about the ex not returning her - I have had conversations about what to do. Those conversations are not dis-similar to the stranger danger message... So unless the ex locks the kid in the basement my kid can sort this one and if the kid is locked in the basement the cops will come a knocking....

    Desperate for the kids to see dad? right? Your doing your " best to make sure he is in their lives despite the circumstances." I disagree. If you're that keen then apply to court for court orders that say when the kids spend time with you and when they spend time with him. ... Heck, while you're their you can request the court orders drug tests... Once you've done that, you can truly say you're doing your best to make sure he is in their lives.

    Ex and partner have been to jail. Ok, but not for child abuse... And don't we live in a society where once you've paid your debt to society and released you have done your time?

    So let me play a game called what if... What if he applied to court for access. Would he get it? Yup I reckon he would. So sure you could stop the kids until he does that court application, but that is the opposite of the wole I'm doing all I can to facilitate access argument.

    Final rant... Drug addicts don't want kids they want drugs. If he has got his life together enough to contact you for access, I'm willing to bet he has gotten his sh*t together enough to look after them for a week or two.
     
  7. Breek

    Breek Member

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    Thanks Sammy01
     
  8. sammy01

    sammy01 Well-Known Member

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    wow - you're welcome... I didn't think you'd like my response, so thanks for accepting it as a relevant opinion.... Even though you may not have liked it.
     
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