She wouldn't need to be at first mention, but would need to either be at subsequent hearing to defend the application or pay for a lawyer..... In some jurisdictions, as a victim, she can say she feels threatened by the respondent & seek to avoid being questioned by the respondent.... In that event, there is a system whereby the court must supply a lawyer (paid for by the scheme) to question the applicant, at least in family law jurisdiction anyway...
VIC Intervention order procedures
- Thread starter rajb
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- child intervention order order
Need a better source than the Ed dept.
Not my area but a quick look indicated an intervention order is not enough to trigger a negative notice.
BTW, registered teachers are exempt from a wwc in Vic * wonders if some other kind of check is done.
I found the same from the AIFS website at ...... Table 2. Information considered in Working With Children Checks. Victoria
Source>>> Part A: Overview
Hi guys,
Just an update on my situation. Its been three weeks since my first mediation and still waiting on my ex to go through her session but it looks like she is pushing it further like end of the month.
I asked court about my initial mention date. They told me to fill the IVO application to revoke/vary/extend form and bring it to the Magistrates. I went to Magistrates court hoping to get a date but they said I could get a "asking for leave" straight away from the judge. Prior to that the duty lawyer suggested that to remove my daughter using the variation would not have any impact unless your circumstances have changed. It is highly probable that the Judge wouldn't approve the application to vary unless that you have moved closer to her due to work or some similar situation.
Lawyer suggested that I could go see my daughter even with the IVO if I have a written agreement between two parties. If my ex will accept it is the biggest question. My initial court date is set to October 2020 so that means I won't see my daughter 8 months or more depending on the outcome. I have been stressed and sleepless many nights thinking about this situation. Some lawyers mentioned that I may pursue an anger management & parenting after separation courses while waiting. I am not a violent person and for my defence if she says that I am at-least I have some sort of evidence to prove that I have gone through this to the judge. Also with parenting I wasn't given the chance to bath or put my kid to sleep after 4 months of birth which is when I moved out because my ex wanted space. The course will hopefully help me care for my child in the future if my ex says that I am not a capable father right?
What do you guys suggest I should do in these turbulence times in my life? Should I wait for the mediation secessions to finish and god knows when she will come to the table?
If I seek a lawyer they will charge north of $2000 just to engage with limited negotiations and it continues to grow.
Just an update on my situation. Its been three weeks since my first mediation and still waiting on my ex to go through her session but it looks like she is pushing it further like end of the month.
I asked court about my initial mention date. They told me to fill the IVO application to revoke/vary/extend form and bring it to the Magistrates. I went to Magistrates court hoping to get a date but they said I could get a "asking for leave" straight away from the judge. Prior to that the duty lawyer suggested that to remove my daughter using the variation would not have any impact unless your circumstances have changed. It is highly probable that the Judge wouldn't approve the application to vary unless that you have moved closer to her due to work or some similar situation.
Lawyer suggested that I could go see my daughter even with the IVO if I have a written agreement between two parties. If my ex will accept it is the biggest question. My initial court date is set to October 2020 so that means I won't see my daughter 8 months or more depending on the outcome. I have been stressed and sleepless many nights thinking about this situation. Some lawyers mentioned that I may pursue an anger management & parenting after separation courses while waiting. I am not a violent person and for my defence if she says that I am at-least I have some sort of evidence to prove that I have gone through this to the judge. Also with parenting I wasn't given the chance to bath or put my kid to sleep after 4 months of birth which is when I moved out because my ex wanted space. The course will hopefully help me care for my child in the future if my ex says that I am not a capable father right?
What do you guys suggest I should do in these turbulence times in my life? Should I wait for the mediation secessions to finish and god knows when she will come to the table?
If I seek a lawyer they will charge north of $2000 just to engage with limited negotiations and it continues to grow.
Are you saying that she has been set a date but keeps cancelling?
Paragraph 9 part (a) of your IVO suggests that you can do that.... however If she keeps cancelling mediation then I think you will have to seek a section 60I certificate from mediator so you can start an initiating application for parenting with the family court.... She won't be able to dodge responding & mediation then.... You can file that initial application yourself to get things moving
Going to be tough time... rather than spending money on an anger management course, perhaps a good counselor would be more beneficial for you... They can certainly help you with the inevitable anger & frustration that you may experience, but also teach you coping mechanisms... The next months will be important for you to stay positive regardless of how much you are messed around.... Just know that even though it may be slow, the family court is on your side as far as you & your daughter being able to form a meaningful relationship....
Yeah - forget anger management. From what I've heard you can walk away from that stuff more frustrated than when you started... A good counsellor is a good idea. Go see your doctor and you might get a referal for some free counselling.
Get solicitor to write to ex asking for time with the kid. If that doesn't work, get mediation done and get into the family courts quick. If the ex won't let you see the child get a magistrate to make the decision.
Get solicitor to write to ex asking for time with the kid. If that doesn't work, get mediation done and get into the family courts quick. If the ex won't let you see the child get a magistrate to make the decision.
Hi guys,
Update on my situation - Still haven't been able to see my daughter since the IVO was lodged in April and it is very heartbreaking. I don't even know how she is or what she is going through. She will be turning 2 next month.
Ex finally told the mediators that she is not going through meditation and they issued me a section 60I certificate. I have passed the certificate to my lawyers and they have sent her a letter asking for time with my daughter in the interim. Now I am eagerly waiting for a reply or some sort of visitation agreement which will put my mind at ease.
If she denies then we then have to initiate parenting orders through the Federal circuit court which is not going to be cheap. I am so worried how a person can falsely accuse someone of being a violent when he is the total opposite (a loving father). All in all I've got to know from others that my ex always wanted to be a single mother and she may have used me to have a child but that doesn't matter now.
Is there any other way to get into family courts early to get access to my child when my interim IVO is pending for October court hearing? I really want to concentrate on the family court side to get access to my daughter.
Update on my situation - Still haven't been able to see my daughter since the IVO was lodged in April and it is very heartbreaking. I don't even know how she is or what she is going through. She will be turning 2 next month.
Ex finally told the mediators that she is not going through meditation and they issued me a section 60I certificate. I have passed the certificate to my lawyers and they have sent her a letter asking for time with my daughter in the interim. Now I am eagerly waiting for a reply or some sort of visitation agreement which will put my mind at ease.
If she denies then we then have to initiate parenting orders through the Federal circuit court which is not going to be cheap. I am so worried how a person can falsely accuse someone of being a violent when he is the total opposite (a loving father). All in all I've got to know from others that my ex always wanted to be a single mother and she may have used me to have a child but that doesn't matter now.
Is there any other way to get into family courts early to get access to my child when my interim IVO is pending for October court hearing? I really want to concentrate on the family court side to get access to my daughter.
@rajb first off, i feel for what you are going through. Im no lawyer but can give you my take and experience.
Have you been to court at all yet in this case? Or did she apply in April and your first hesring is in Oct?
Me
> in March 2020 i got an FVIIO issued. Applicant was the cops. Kids were protected persons. I had a few more clauses in mine than you but much of a muchness
> my kids were 3.5yo and not yet 1.5yo
> I represented myself
> i went to court first hearing (april so only a 2 week wait) and got the children removed. Police did not oppose
> the case has since been adjourned and i still have the FVIIO. I will continue to represent myself. Three court appearances (1x kid removed, 2x adjourned). Im back there in Oct.
> i live in Vic
Advice
> police liaison officer said i could see the kids if my ex consented. This was while they were listed as protected persons. He has been a liaison officer primarily of FVOs for 10 years and knows.
> two different cop stations plus a local lawyer (i didnt use them further than the discounted $55 30min session) said i couldnt. So not all cops or lawyers say the same thing and dont assume they are always right.
> Ring the cops. Your local ones. Talk to them. Ask them how you can avoid a breach and see your kid. If the cop says you cant, ask to talk to your local police liaison officer. Even though they arent the apllicant they'll give you advice. Remember, its them rocking up to the scene when your ex cries breach. And as above, i got different responses and answers from different cops and different police stations. Understand what your local cops think. The ones that would likely be arresting you. If they say 'nah mate, you cant see them' but their liaison officer says its ok, then ensure you educate the cops 'oh ok, cause your local police liaison officer said i could if XY and Z occurred. Could you double check this as i dont want to breach my order'. Show the cops you care for your daughter and want to abide by the law. If you hear things you like, ask the cop to email it you. So if you get arrested you can say 'but constable X said it was ok' and if you have that email then youre in a much better position.
> get everything in writing. If you speak to her and she says 'come and grab the kid' and you say sure and rock up you may have the cops there. If she is vindictive she may try this to get you breached. The cops said to me (when i rung as above), if we rock up and you show me a text from her that says 'come over and grab the kids' then they'd drive away and tell her not to do that again. It would also be a mark against her intrigity you have if you need later. It in itsself is nothing, but may help show a pattern of behaviour.
> a good lawyer gave me the following advice which i would do, in my case it was absolutely vital. Write a letter to your ex and her lawyer if she has one. Ask for ALL evidence they intend to use in the case against you. Mention you believe the accusations to be unfounded and baseless. Send them any evidence that may show that either she was an agressor or that you were not an agressor. Ie, a text from her saying 'youre a great dad', 'i know you'd never hurt the kids', etc. Why do this? Because if they proceed all the way and its thrown out based on her having no evidence or due to your evidence, and you had asked for her evidence and shown her yours before trial, then there is a change she'll have to pay some of your legal fees if its withdrawn (ie, she loses). If you dont do this, you have bugger all hope of having any of your fees paid for. If she responds with no evidence, make her sweat your legal fees. That alone may make her withdraw. The local lawyer i first saw is normally $460 per hour. The fact she didnt tell me this simple but vital advice just showed many lawyers are duds.
> Ask for an undertaking as long as the kid is removed. Or try and get the kid removed and then ask for the undertaking. Tbh, i dont know what the best order here is. Basically, an undertaking accepts the conditions of the order with actually having the AVO against your name. If you breach, you can be arrested, go back to court and the AVO could be reistated. I was advised an AVO (FVO) can affect your child custody case once that begins. So my advise would be DO NOT ACCEPT. If you write to her and her lawyer requesting an undertaking, and they go to trial, it again shows your willingness to comply. As i put it in my letter 'as an FVO is not a criminal charge, normally i would have no issue accepting, but due to pending child custody arrangemts, and the fact I have done nothing, and no evidence for the FVO has been provided, I will challenge it all the way but i will accept an undertaking'. Remember, an undertaking gives her the same protections she wants under the AVO but without the black mark of an AVO. As she is the apllicant, it may well save her legal costs and if she is genuinely doing the AVO out of fear she shouldn't have an issue.
> if you have half a brain defend yourself. Rock up to your local magistrates court one day and watch some cases. Gusranteed there will be FVO/AVO cases on. Write down some things the barristers/lawyers say that is either legal jargon, how they approached the judge, or which helped them win. If you dont say 'your honor' then the judge will grease you off and you'll be on the back foot. It was amazing to see how the attitude of defendents influenced the judge (just my opinion). I found some lawyers making big mistakes in understanding the law which were corrected by the judge. Not even I would have made some of these errors. Basically, dont be intimidated. Some of these lawyers doing AVOs graduated 25 years ago and probably done pissy little cases ever since. One lawyer looked like a slob, a s**t suit and totally f****d it. I felt sorry for the dude that paid him. Dont think they know everything or you cant beat them. Sitting in court with a note pad before my cases certainly helped me.
Good luck mate. Hope you get your daughter removed and start to see her again.
Have you been to court at all yet in this case? Or did she apply in April and your first hesring is in Oct?
Me
> in March 2020 i got an FVIIO issued. Applicant was the cops. Kids were protected persons. I had a few more clauses in mine than you but much of a muchness
> my kids were 3.5yo and not yet 1.5yo
> I represented myself
> i went to court first hearing (april so only a 2 week wait) and got the children removed. Police did not oppose
> the case has since been adjourned and i still have the FVIIO. I will continue to represent myself. Three court appearances (1x kid removed, 2x adjourned). Im back there in Oct.
> i live in Vic
Advice
> police liaison officer said i could see the kids if my ex consented. This was while they were listed as protected persons. He has been a liaison officer primarily of FVOs for 10 years and knows.
> two different cop stations plus a local lawyer (i didnt use them further than the discounted $55 30min session) said i couldnt. So not all cops or lawyers say the same thing and dont assume they are always right.
> Ring the cops. Your local ones. Talk to them. Ask them how you can avoid a breach and see your kid. If the cop says you cant, ask to talk to your local police liaison officer. Even though they arent the apllicant they'll give you advice. Remember, its them rocking up to the scene when your ex cries breach. And as above, i got different responses and answers from different cops and different police stations. Understand what your local cops think. The ones that would likely be arresting you. If they say 'nah mate, you cant see them' but their liaison officer says its ok, then ensure you educate the cops 'oh ok, cause your local police liaison officer said i could if XY and Z occurred. Could you double check this as i dont want to breach my order'. Show the cops you care for your daughter and want to abide by the law. If you hear things you like, ask the cop to email it you. So if you get arrested you can say 'but constable X said it was ok' and if you have that email then youre in a much better position.
> get everything in writing. If you speak to her and she says 'come and grab the kid' and you say sure and rock up you may have the cops there. If she is vindictive she may try this to get you breached. The cops said to me (when i rung as above), if we rock up and you show me a text from her that says 'come over and grab the kids' then they'd drive away and tell her not to do that again. It would also be a mark against her intrigity you have if you need later. It in itsself is nothing, but may help show a pattern of behaviour.
> a good lawyer gave me the following advice which i would do, in my case it was absolutely vital. Write a letter to your ex and her lawyer if she has one. Ask for ALL evidence they intend to use in the case against you. Mention you believe the accusations to be unfounded and baseless. Send them any evidence that may show that either she was an agressor or that you were not an agressor. Ie, a text from her saying 'youre a great dad', 'i know you'd never hurt the kids', etc. Why do this? Because if they proceed all the way and its thrown out based on her having no evidence or due to your evidence, and you had asked for her evidence and shown her yours before trial, then there is a change she'll have to pay some of your legal fees if its withdrawn (ie, she loses). If you dont do this, you have bugger all hope of having any of your fees paid for. If she responds with no evidence, make her sweat your legal fees. That alone may make her withdraw. The local lawyer i first saw is normally $460 per hour. The fact she didnt tell me this simple but vital advice just showed many lawyers are duds.
> Ask for an undertaking as long as the kid is removed. Or try and get the kid removed and then ask for the undertaking. Tbh, i dont know what the best order here is. Basically, an undertaking accepts the conditions of the order with actually having the AVO against your name. If you breach, you can be arrested, go back to court and the AVO could be reistated. I was advised an AVO (FVO) can affect your child custody case once that begins. So my advise would be DO NOT ACCEPT. If you write to her and her lawyer requesting an undertaking, and they go to trial, it again shows your willingness to comply. As i put it in my letter 'as an FVO is not a criminal charge, normally i would have no issue accepting, but due to pending child custody arrangemts, and the fact I have done nothing, and no evidence for the FVO has been provided, I will challenge it all the way but i will accept an undertaking'. Remember, an undertaking gives her the same protections she wants under the AVO but without the black mark of an AVO. As she is the apllicant, it may well save her legal costs and if she is genuinely doing the AVO out of fear she shouldn't have an issue.
> if you have half a brain defend yourself. Rock up to your local magistrates court one day and watch some cases. Gusranteed there will be FVO/AVO cases on. Write down some things the barristers/lawyers say that is either legal jargon, how they approached the judge, or which helped them win. If you dont say 'your honor' then the judge will grease you off and you'll be on the back foot. It was amazing to see how the attitude of defendents influenced the judge (just my opinion). I found some lawyers making big mistakes in understanding the law which were corrected by the judge. Not even I would have made some of these errors. Basically, dont be intimidated. Some of these lawyers doing AVOs graduated 25 years ago and probably done pissy little cases ever since. One lawyer looked like a slob, a s**t suit and totally f****d it. I felt sorry for the dude that paid him. Dont think they know everything or you cant beat them. Sitting in court with a note pad before my cases certainly helped me.
Good luck mate. Hope you get your daughter removed and start to see her again.
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I forgot to mention, in the letter, write that you believe you are not a risk to the protected persons, that since the FVO was issued your conduct has been exemplary, and you are in no way a danger to you ex or your daughter. As you want your daughter removed, mention you have gone to relationships Australia and made all efforts for mediation. That although you have the cert that you still want your ex and you to mediate as that is the best outcome for your daughter. Mention how you are a dotting father (but dont lie, if you've not been that involved then dont go overboard here as she may show evidence otherwise) and that you love your daughter and that you believe its important for your daughter to have a meaningful relationship with her father and grandpare ts who see has got to know. This all shows intent.
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