QLD Property Settlement and Mediation - Husband Not Declaring Assets?

[RachaelMC]

Hi,

I have been separated for few months from a long relationship. My daughter and I moved out of the family home because ex refused to. Few days after we moved out, he pushed for property settlement. I wasn't ready and felt rushed, so I asked for more time.

He since sent me lots of offers but all of them are of the same value and are for his benefits, which is, he keeps the family home and gives me half the equity in cash, which won't be enough to buy another house to live in. He didn't include his overseas property in the division.

After settling in in the new place, I worked out our property pool to the best of my knowledge and sent him an offer, on the basis that I buy him out so our child can live in the family home. He refused, and considers that he is more entitled to the family home.

I got legal advice. My lawyer sent him a first communication asking him to declare. He also sent him my declaration. He replied himself to my lawyer which was of no value. He didn't declare. He deleted his overseas property from the property pool.

He told my lawyer that he will consider going to mediation only if we discuss his offers. He is insisting that he wants to keep the family home and he wants to pay me half of the equity.

My questions:

Can we go to mediation if we haven't agreed on a property pool? Wouldn't it be a waste of money?
I see no point communicating with him if he isn't declaring, so I assume my next step is applying to the courts.

If we end up in court would the judge force us to go to mediation if we don't agree on a property pool?

Would I have a chance to be able to buy him out? I was told because I moved my chances aren't that great.

 

[Clancy]

Ok so he has not actually sort legal advice as yet?

What he is doing is adding things up according to his own way of thinking. A lawyer or a mediator will teach him how to add things up based on the way a court sees things. So it is well worth going to mediation despite how hopeless it seems.

 

[RachaelMC]

Ok so he has not actually sort legal advice as yet?
What he is doing is adding things up according to his own way of thinking.
A lawyer or a mediator will teach him how to add things up based on the way a court sees things. So it is well worth going to mediation despite how hopeless it seems.

I believe he saw a lawyer for an initial consultation, but he doesn't want to pay to use their services. He wants things separated his way without lawyers. He is extremely stubborn and i feel the cost involved in mediation will be wasted. I could be wrong as I have never been to one and I don't know how convincing the mediator can be

Thank you for your reply.

 

[sammy01]

Have there been conversations about the time he will spend with the child?

Inform him that you're prepared to discuss his offer... Nothing wrong with discussing it. Part of the discussion can be that he has forgotten his OS property. Perhaps get your solicitor to write to him asking for him to divulged all assets including an independent evaluation of the OS property.

How old is child? How long were you living together? How much super do you have? Does he have shares? Anything else?

Look, if you lived with him for 2 yrs and have one child... If he had lots of assets at the start and you had none... Then maybe what he is offering is fair... But if you have one child who is 2, lived together for 10 yrs and are on roughly equal incomes and you contributed the deposit for the family home at the start then what he is offering is off the mark...

So why not give us a ball park on the figures and maybe you'll get some advice here on how far off the mark he is....

 

[RachaelMC]

have there been conversations about the time he will spend with the child?
Inform him that you're prepared to discuss his offer... NOTHING wrong with discussing it.... Part of the discussion can be that he has forgotten his OS property. Perhaps get your solicitor to write to him asking for him to divulged all assets including an independent evaluation of the OS property.

How old is child? how long were you living together? How much super do you have? does he have? shares? anything else? Look, if you lived with him for 2 yrs and have one child... IF he had lots of assets at the start and you had none... Then MAYBE what he is offering is fair... BUT if you have one child who is 2, lived together for 10 yrs and are on roughly equal incomes and you contributed the deposit for the family home at the start THEN what he is offering is off the mark...

So why not give us a ball park on the figures and maybe you'll get some advice here on how far off the mark he is....

Child is 8. We have another grown up child between us. It was a 22 years marriage.

Super is equal. Both worked, I looked after kids and house duties. He hasn't forgotten about his overseas assets, I mentioned them in my property pool estimate, he took them off completely. He just doesn't want me to have half.

On top of that he wants to also keep the family home. In his opinion he did it all. He says the house is his even if it is in joint names, even though I worked just as hard and looked after him and our kids.

Child is shared between us 80% with me 20% with him. He now works full time i am part time. We couldn't agree on the child's arrangement until we attended mediation, he basically wanted her every weekend and not during the week because he works during the week which is fair enough but weekends are the quality time with the kid and i wanted some quality time too.

We got to the most complex arrangement due to his stubbornness, it was an all day mediation session.

I know his offering is off mark. I feel that is why he doesn't want to use a lawyer. A lawyer will advice him to declare like my lawyer did. That is why I am hoping to go straight to court without mediation. I see it as pointless if he isn't declaring.

It was an emotionally abusive relationship and took me years to gather my guts to leave him.
Oh, did I mention that I pay rent in the place me and my child live, and he forced me to pay the mortgage at the family home where he lives!

My lawyer told him to pay the mortgage but he refuses. He wants to send me broke so i can't fight him and I am afraid he is getting there.

 

[Complex16]

You’re going to need a mediation certificate anyway to make an application to the court so you have nothing to lose at this stage. Mediation is very inexpensive and/or free through Relationships Australia? Book in and see how it goes, might give him a reality check and prompt him to declare accurately and appropriately?

 

[Clancy]

Ohhhhh he is the emotionally abusive type? Would you say he is narcissistic? Because dealing with a narcissist is a completely different ball game.... you could march him up to the gates of hell but he wont back down.

So if he is a Narcissist you will want to change your thinking, your goal will be to deal with the court, not your ex.

Still, you have to go through the process of mediation before going to court..... what you want to do is just maintain an act of being a responsible co-operative person - even though you know you will not succeed in mediation you still need to 'pretend' you are there to get an agreement, put on a nice show..... its all for the legal system, not your ex.

 

[sammy01]

Nope he isn't forcing you to pay the mortgage.... You are choosing to. Stop paying it... Go on dare ya. You are wasting money by paying his mortgage... Look he sounds pretty unreasonable. BTW - I'm not a big fan of people diagnosing folk they have never met... Everyone's ex all of a sudden becomes a narcissist after separation, just like caught fish get better everytime the story gets re-told.

So have you applied for child support? if not, why not?

Stop paying the mortgage asap.

BTW for any financial settlement to be legally binding both parties need independent legal advice, so solicitors are basically unavoidable.

Why should he want to change the current set up, he gets the kid when he wants... and he has you paying money that you don't have to pay and you will never see again... You have to do something to change the current set up... Wait and see how fast he runs to a solicitor to sue you (blah blah)for not paying the mortgage

 

[Clancy]

Nope he isn't forcing you to pay the mortgage.... You are choosing to. Stop paying it... Go on dare ya. You are wasting money by paying his mortgage... Look he sounds pretty unreasonable. BTW - I'm not a big fan of people diagnosing folk they have never met... Everyone's ex all of a sudden becomes a narcissist after separation, just like caught fish get better everytime the story gets re-told.

So have you applied for child support? if not, why not?

Stop paying the mortgage asap.

BTW for any financial settlement to be legally binding both parties need independent legal advice, so solicitors are basically unavoidable.

Why should he want to change the current set up, he gets the kid when he wants... and he has you paying money that you don't have to pay and you will never see again... You have to do something to change the current set up... Wait and see how fast he runs to a solicitor to sue you (blah blah)for not paying the mortgage

Do not for one second underestimate what you are up against if your ex is a genuine narcissist! Fish are fish, some caught up in revenge, hurt people will try to hurt you back etc etc, but a genuine narcissist IS something entirely different. Yes we all have trouble with Ex's, myself included, my friends etc, but my sister had to deal with an ex that was a narcissist - this situation ABSOLUTELY stands out above the rest, i will just warn you now.

 

[sammy01]

yup narcs are bad news... But this is a law forum. No-one here can diagnose someone based on a few posts... I tend to refer to my ex simply as a nutter.

Some people are certainly less capable of negotiating reasonably than others... With those sorts of people who need to stare them down and realise that they are almost intuitively/ instinctive/ manipulative / strategic than your average punter.. In my case the ex genuinely believed she was entitled to 105% of the joint assets despite never doing a days work through the relationship - YUP 105%...
So in this person's case - She genuinely thinks the ex is 'forcing' her to pay half the mortgage.. If she stops she will get nasty messages, she will be told she is ruining both his and her credit rating... She will be told that when it goes to court she will be forced to pay the money back with interest blah blah it will be intimidation and not even a little bit illegal unless it is threatening.... But until the dynamic changes he won't mention the OS assets and will continue living in a house and only paying for half of it.