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QLD When Should Family Court Orders be Carried Out?

Discussion in 'Family Law Forum' started by Migz, 3 January 2017.

  1. Migz

    Migz Well-Known Member

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    Ok, so I've got a query for those in the know.

    My 8-month-old daughter flies off to Samoa tomorrow (4th January until the 15th January 2017) with her mother (my ex) for a family wedding.

    Family Court Orders regarding this one off trip were made on the 5th Dec 2016.

    "7. That the mother provide to the father a copy of the travel itinerary, return airfares, accommodation, telephone contact number and itinerary of activities.

    8. That the mother provide a proper insurance policy for the child and provide a copy of that policy to the father.

    9. That the child xxxxxxx born xxxxxxxx 2016 (“the child”) spend time with the father as follows: (a) From 11.00am until 2.00pm on 1 January 2017; and (b) From 11.00am until 2.00pm on 2 January 2017."

    Point 9 was carried out, and the visitations took place.

    Questions; Point 7 and point 8 haven't been provided as of yet, so my question is when should they be provided and at what point would it be classed as a breach?
     
  2. SamanthaJay

    SamanthaJay Well-Known Member

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    There wasn't a time period given in the orders I'm assuming? From what I've read on here, the orders usually specify that this information is to be provided so many days/weeks before travel.
     
  3. Migz

    Migz Well-Known Member

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    Hi Sammy01,

    I was under that impression as well, that all paperwork was to be handed over 7 days prior to leaving. But there is nothing at all in the orders other than the times given for visitation
     
  4. sammy01

    sammy01 Well-Known Member

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    Pick your fights....

    The info should have been provided before departure. It ain't going to happen. Worth doing a contravention on? Nope.

    So if there was no order to provide the info prior to leaving then you could waste time / money on the contravention only to have mum provide the info before the contravention hearing... I reckon it is only worth doing contraventions if it impacts on the time you spend with the kid.
     
  5. MartyK

    MartyK Well-Known Member

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    Do you have any fears that she will not return with the child Migs?
     
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  6. Migz

    Migz Well-Known Member

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    Well MartyK, considering her brother (still works there) and his wife and 3 kids live there, there is that possibility. Do I think that she may not return personally? No. She is on a very good wicket here in Australia, and I don't see her throwing that away to go back to living in a developing country again.

    Plus the Judge has made her pay a $5,000 bond... Big deal, as no one can seem to tell me if it's actually been paid, and the mother hasn't supplied a receipt or statement to say so.

    What is concerning that she hasn't fulfilled her obligations in regards to the court order.

    Secondly, I have no accommodation address, or point of contact for my daughter whilst she is overseas.

    And lastly, what insurance policy is she now covered under as the previous one she had for my daughter, was credit card complimentary insurance, which didn't cover her for stuff all, which is why the Judge asked her to upgrade it?

    Cheers
     
  7. sammy01

    sammy01 Well-Known Member

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    OK - so are you self-representing?

    If no - then have a chat with a solicitor about their thoughts.

    You know your case better than anyone here. It might help to show that mum is no good at playing nice and following reasonable requests but it might be also true that you're wasting money on the contravention as she will only get a warning, and especially if it didn't impact on your time with the kid.

    So my theory goes like this... A contravention is a waste of time unless a problem is on going and it restricts your time with the kid.

    Story time - I had court orders that said I have half Christmas Day. She told me I wasn't gonna be seeing the kids at Christmas. She had some crazy BS to 'justify' her decision not to follow the orders.

    I didn't see the kids on Christmas Day. She gave them to me on boxing day... I was well upset, but I didn't do a contravention.... Why? What's the point? I wasn't gonna get Christmas back... So by my way of thinking, it wasn't worth the stress / money time, etc to stand in court and listen to a magistrate tell the ex that she was a very naughty girl and she must not do it again, only to listen to her blabber on about how it was a misunderstanding, or the kids were sick or some other BS...

    Who knows, she might have even apologised and cried her eyes out, but it all would have been for show. The fact is, when my youngest child was celebrating his first Christmas, I wasn't there and that is all that mattered to my ex and nothing a court can do is gonna change it.

    So in your case, I reckon it is worth asking yourself these questions - Has your time with the kid been negatively affected? Is the concern ongoing? Is it likely the court is gonna be able to do anything about it? Now I reckon the answer is no on all fronts. So I wouldn't bother.
     
  8. Migz

    Migz Well-Known Member

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    This is where we clash heads again Sammy01, and why I continue to say the system is broken. Yes, self-rep.

    With your thought process, (whilst I agree with parts of it) what's the point of having court orders at all if one parent just continues on their merry way and continues to do their own thing as they are on a complete powertrip. I'm not going to stand by and let her just make a mockery of "the system", once again what's the point of having "the system" at all.

    As of this morning;

    1. I have sent her a detailed email, and have asked her to fulfill her obligations to the court order by midday.

    2. I have spoken to a registrar in the Family Law Courts who was able to bring up my file, and that nothing new had been filed, but the $5,000 bond money was paid on the 29th Dec 2016 (that's a good start).

    3. I advised them of the email that I had sent her.

    4. I was then advised that it would be in my best interests to file an "Application - Contravention" today and get it into the mail should the orders not be met.

    5. I will also contact the Airline later today, and I will also contact the AFP at the airport. (might not do any good) but I'm not going to sit idly by

    Sammy01, as I'm only new to this and my daughter is very young, I see a lot of court appearances ahead, so if the mother wishes to continue on with her "I am greater than the law" mentality, then if I can prove to the court that she cannot adhere to her own hand written parenting plan (as she proved last week) and "Court Orders" then at some point along the way I might just get a judge who flips our positions and I become Primary Care Giver.

    Cheers
     
  9. sammy01

    sammy01 Well-Known Member

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    Look, if you're self-representing then I reckon the contravention is a good idea.... But for a different reason.

    So remember my Christmas story. I considered doing a contravention and self-representing on that one. For two reasons:

    1 - She was paying a solicitor and I figured a contravention would cost me the filing fee but it would cost her lots more. While I kinda agree that the system is pretty crook and if I had my way, I'd eliminate solicitors from it altogether.

    But one way to get her to play nice is to make her realise the expenses. So a letter to her solicitor about her failure to comply with the court orders is also worthwhile.

    And

    2. You've got nothing to lose. Since you feel confident that you're gonna be spending lots of time sitting in family court. Having a few goes at it on relatively insignificant issues that you can afford to lose will still provide you with some valuable learning experiences about the whole process.
     
  10. MartyK

    MartyK Well-Known Member

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    As I believe SamanthaJay suggested, the biggest issue you have here Migz is a poorly worded order (paragraph 7). While it is entirely up to you what you choose to do, a contravention application requires the applicant to prove a breach has occurred. This technically leaves you only with paragraph 8.

    However, while the mother may have breached this order, as a bond of $5000 has been entered into, then you would risk looking bad (in the eyes of the court) if you pursued it. Perhaps filing a supplementary affidavit, if you are adamant the court should be made aware?
     
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