NSW What to Do After First Directions Hearing?

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Twooke

Well-Known Member
11 October 2017
29
2
124
Hi all,

Back again just with an update and some questions on where to go from here!

I have a 15-month-old son, who I haven't seen in 9 months. I had a first court appearance in October, which my ex did not turn up to, so the first directions hearing got reset for today. There is an AVO in place which I accepted without admission, although I really wish that I fought it now as her solicitor brought this up in every sentence he said today!

I received my ex's affidavit at 3:04 pm yesterday, so I had no chance to make a response. Not one truth was said and instead was a whole lot of lies and embellishments, which showed why I am the worst person to ever walk the earth, and that she was seeking a no contact order between my son and I.

In the notice of risk, she ticked all boxes saying I had done everything bad to our son including sexual abuse (her affidavit says "while I never witnessed anything sexual occurring, T (meaning me) would take longer than necessary changing nappies and often closed the door while doing so" as well as making sure I was the one that always bathed him!) Absolutely horrible to read!

When she said I was controlling - an example was that we once took our son to a football game and while we were there, I told him that one day he'll be playing for Sydney FC and bought him a Jersey and baby membership. She said that this showed that I would not let our son make his own choices in life and that I was placing pressure on not only our son but her as well to make sure he was a successful footballer and that I was controlling his choices into his future! There are a lot more "examples" in her affidavit just like these but don't want to go into too much detail.

The Judge ended up giving my son and I, 1, 2 hour supervised visit a week in a supervision centre, which I feel is nowhere near enough for a child of that age to bond with their parent. I cited a lot of journal articles and such in support of "less time, more frequently" for a child of my son's age, and the 11F convener agreed with my proposal, but our next hearing is at the start of March, with only 2 hours a week. I asked for there to be increases in time after the first month but this was declined as well.

Now, as happy and over the moon as I am that I will be allowed to see my son soon and reestablish our bond again, and have to accept this as a starting point... but my questions are:

1. How long my will I be made to be supervised for when getting to see my son? I am absolutely not a danger in the slightest, have my working with childrens check, go into primary schools once a week for coaching and training sessions and have done so for 5 years. I do holiday care and activities for primary aged children, have never been violent (except for my exes version of events of when I got an AVO), but I'm having to be supervised to see my own son!

2. What is there I can do between now and March to show that I am not a danger to our son so that I can get off this supervised contact and get more time with my boy? Will the supervisors reports be enough? Should I go through my exes affidavit and answer every paragraph she wrote and build up evidence against what she has said?

3. In my ex's application for the AVO, she claimed that I was physically violent to her the whole relationship, yet when she wrote her affidavit for family court, the only "example" of physical violence she alleged was the one that placed me on the AVO! Would I be able to use the statement she made when applying for the AVO (alleging multiple occasions of physical altercations) against her affidavit alleging only 1? I just ask this as I feel that these contradict each other!

Thanks in advance,
 

AllForHer

Well-Known Member
23 July 2014
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First, I am sorry to hear things didn't go your way, but hey, supervised time is better than no time at all, and when you have supervisors, you have proof that you're not a threat, so try and take it on the chin and start preparing for the next hearing.

Your first question - nobody knows how long supervised will last, but I would consider filing an Application in a Case maybe three or so weeks before your next hearing so that you can try and get the interim orders changed to unsupervised time.

In your affidavit supporting the application in a case, there's a few things you should consider including - the supervisor's report as one, the information about your role in the community working with kids as another, and your denial of the allegations made against you by your ex. When denying the allegations, you don't need to provide an abundance of evidence to the contrary, you really just need to say 'In response to the allegations made in Paragraph X of the respondent's affidavit deposed on date Y, I deny that I have ever done Z'. Once you challenge the allegation, the onus is upon her to prove her allegations, not you to disprove them.

Your second question - sure, there are things you can do. First, sign up for a post separation parenting course through Relationships Australia. They're free, and they're a good demonstration of willingness to co-operate. Second, make sure your life is organised to facilitate more time with your kid.

Does your work schedule allow you to collect your kid from child care? Does he have his own room or space at your house? Clothes, toys, books, bed, possessions? Third, keep communicating from time to time with your ex's lawyer to negotiate settlements outside of Court. They probably won't comply, but it shows you want to work together.

Your third question - look, don't get bogged down with the allegations. If she's saying ludicrous things like "I haven't actually seen anything, but he took a long time to change a nappy once" (which indicates that you helped change nappies, doesn't it?), her credibility on the witness stand is going to come apart very quickly because all she's doing is criticising you as a parent, without recognising how important you are to your son - her interests first, your son's interests second, no? On top of that, she's seeking orders that the child spend no time with you at all, and she's already failed at the very first mention, hasn't she?

Have a read of this case: Pike & Skilton [2017] FCCA 2466 (13 October 2017)

This is a recent one where allegations of sexual abuse were made on very flimsy evidence - some of it not even unlike the evidence you've mentioned above. It might give you some faith in the system.
 
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Twooke

Well-Known Member
11 October 2017
29
2
124
Thanks Allforher,

That case was a very interesting read, and yeah it related a lot to my situation. It does give me a bit of faith. What I have realised in the last 9 months is that it's a long process, but have hope for the best... eventually!

A few things, when you said I need to show that I can facilitate my time and have things organised, I've basically taken over my poor Auntie's house and have converted her old spare room into a bedroom for my son (I'm now using 2 of the 3 bedrooms in her house). I brought photos in of the room showing that he has everything he needs here yesterday and they weren't even looked at. If I annex these in my next affidavit is that they will be seen?

After reading through her affidavit over and over, each time I've read it, it's become less and less daunting and it's no where near as bad as what I thought when I first read it so when I denying the stuff I didn't do... what about with the things I did do, like taking him to a football game and telling him that one day he'll play for Sydney - like I did do that, but it wasn't control at all, it was sharing a dream I have for him and there was no control aspect about it.

I don't care if he doesn't like soccer when he grows up but it's a hope I have to go to the park and kick a ball around with him when he's older. Do I have to explain why I said this? Or just not even touch on it!

There was an "example" of how I neglected him during the 6 months I was with him and that was that I wouldn't feed him when he was hungry... but he was entirely breastfed the whole time and she conveniently left that part out... do I explain this?
 

sammy01

Well-Known Member
27 September 2015
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You're not gonna like this.... I want this to take time... Lots of time. The longer it drags out the more obvious it will be that her allegations are without substance. Good.

The child is very young, so the longer it takes the better. Magistrates don't like making orders that stretch too far into the future... So with a 15mth old child the magistrate is not likely to give you substantial time... But in another 18 months, this will be different.

Also 1X 2 hour visit a week, what if she doesn't show? Seems possible based on past performances? What is gonna be her defense? Too busy? forgot? 2 hours a week - Magistrate isn't gonna have a bar of it.

More bad news - 15mth old is a real problem. Back in the day, my ex agreed for 1 hour with my infant. With drop off at Macca's - One measly hour... She would be late there at 1.15 but still insist I drop the kid back at 2... Little one would cry and reach out for mum... Mum loved it. But that is what little ones do. So prepare yourself for it...

The good news and not legal advice - mate, I gave up. Decided that whole primary attachment theory was spot on. But I had it wrong, see in my head, I thought because I wasn't seeing the little one, he would soon forget about me and the damage would be done. Not even close.... totally wrong... to be honest, I reckon I'm a better dad because of it all. Because of the struggle just to have some involvement in the kid's lives has made me appreciate them all the more...

One last piece of non-legal advice. I'm not a psychologist... I'm also not a fan of diagnosing people I have not met, often here you read about people claiming someone is a narcissist or border line personality or what ever.... I just like the phrase nutter. Clearly your ex has issues if she thinks buying your kid a Sydney FC jersey mean's you're a bad dad, different story if it was Melbourne FC... True... but, you're gonna have to learn to play along...

This is a long road... Mate, you might want to talk to a psychologist. You're gonna need to learn some strategies to help you deal with nutter in the long term so that she doesn't cause you to become a nutter too...

Keep us updated mate and keep up the good fight.
 

AllForHer

Well-Known Member
23 July 2014
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So, when you respond to the allegation that you didn't feed the kid when hungry, just say that you deny the allegation that you were neglectful and depose that the child was wholly breastfed between birth and X months of age.

For the jersey, this is the factual statement: dad bought kid a jersey. This is the speculative statement: dad is controlling.

That's not really that bad when you account for the fact that the Court deals in facts, not speculation.

I don't think there's any need to annexe photos of the set up for your kid's home. Think of evidence as an invitation - you invite the other side to accept or refuse a fact. If they accept it, no further discussion needed. If they refuse it, then you need to provide more proof. So, all you need to say in your affidavit is that the child has his own bedroom with suitable cot, toys, clothes, etc. Obviously, her angle is focusing on her contempt for you as an ex, rather than your actual skill as a parent, so is she really going to refute that you can provide for the kid at your home? Probably not.

It's tricky, but you have to rise above the bickering and focus on what matters, which is the kids' best interest. It's a presumption that it's in their best interests to have a relationship with both of you, so mum is fighting against that presumption - and she's already failed, really.
 

Twooke

Well-Known Member
11 October 2017
29
2
124
Hi guys,

Another quick update and question.

I saw my son for the first time in 9 months for an hour on Wednesday. Can I say that hour made the fight to see him for the last 9 months all worthwhile, and not that I needed it, but extra motivation to continue to fight to be someone important in his life.

The lady at the supervision centre even said if there's another positive hour next week, we'll be able to move onto the whole two hours in the new year! I believe both him and I got something out of the visit, and believe that he still remembered me, even though he was stand offish for the first 20 minutes and when I went to leave he came up to me for a hug which was something special.

Thanks for all your help so far guys!

A quick question... my ex asked for sole parental responsibility in her interim orders. Her solicitor didn't even bring that up on the day and wasn't mentioned in the orders given by the judge... With all this reading and studying up that I've done, am I right to believe that equal and shared responsibility is assumed? If so, how does this work with an AVO? Am I able to write to her or her solicitor asking for information on his health etc and try to have some input? Or should I not try to rock the boat at this stage?

And Sammy I kinda agree with ya on the time thing, the longer it goes, the more our bond will strengthen and the more the court will be able To see this... hopefully!

Thanks!
 

SamanthaJay

Well-Known Member
4 July 2016
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That's great for you both that you got to see your little guy :D I'm sure Sammy and AFH will answer your post, but can I just ask if the judge ordered 1 x 2 hour visit a week, why did you only get a 1 hour visit and at least one more 1 hour visit?
 

AllForHer

Well-Known Member
23 July 2014
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That's great to hear that you saw your son on Wednesday, and it sounds like it's given you some hope, too. Too many parents go down the other path - growing very bitter and hateful about the situation, which tends to make matters worse.

So, sole parental responsibility is a very difficult order to have made. It's a presumption under law, which means it's the default position of the law, and the party seeking sole parental responsibility has the onus of trying to rebut the presumption.

To do so, your ex would need to prove that shared parental responsibility isn't in the best interests of the child, usually due to risk of harm from family violence, neglect or abuse. Very, very few parents seeking sole parental responsibility actually succeed in getting it, so don't pay it too much mind because it's up to your ex to prove shared parental responsibility is not in the best interests of the child, not you to prove that shared parental responsibility is in the best interests of the child.

Unless the interim orders state otherwise, you have shared parental responsibility at present, so make sure you're across things like education (for example, make sure you have, or are building a relationship with the child's day care centre), medical needs, etc. While you probably can contact the lawyer about these things, try not to.

As a dad, you are entitled to have your child linked to your Medicare for medical records and treating practitioners, you are entitled to speak to the child's day care (if he's enrolled), etc. Basically, act like you would trying to learn about these things for your kid as though you are entirely on your own - no mum, no lawyer, just you.

My husband and I know everything about my stepdaughter's schooling, medical history, etc., no thanks to her mum - we always talk to the providers directly, rather than try and source information through her mother. We don't like to act like we're dependent on her for anything.
 

Twooke

Well-Known Member
11 October 2017
29
2
124
Hi Samantha,

Yeah it wasn't my choice, it was the supervisors decision, the first two supervision centres I rang up had waiting times and this one, I could see my son before Christmas so I went with these guys and in the interview with the supervisor, According to her this was the first time my son has left my exes side (which I believe would be the case) and the fact that I had not seen him for 9 months, she thought it might be a bit too much for him to go straight to two hours away from his mother and to a strange building full of strangers from the very start.. So she said it would be best for my son, if it was gradual...
It is what it is.. and I just accepted it to see him! It was a good Christmas present!!
 
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SamanthaJay

Well-Known Member
4 July 2016
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794
OK, I didn't realise the supervisors had the power to make those decisions but if that was all that was available, I understand, and I also understand the gradual suggestion.

Your heart must be filled with joy :) Made me a bit teary to read your post!