QLD Child nearly dies on visitation - thoughts?

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AllEars

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22 September 2019
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I have read thread after thread on this forum and am seriously impressed with the quality of answers and the time and effort people responding to questions have put into their answers. I am hoping I'll be lucky enough to get the same quality advice and opinions!

Already involved in family court proceeding where mother has made allegations regarding father's capacity to parent due to mental health issues (diagnosed) and anger management issues. Mother agrees to the 3 children spending holiday time interstate with father.

During the holidays mother is notified during a call by the children that the children and the adults have fallen ill with a bug. We'll call this day 1. All children have symptoms of cold and flu. One child (7) also has fevers diarrhoea and seems more unwell than the others. The following timeline was learned after the events of day 6.
Day 2 and 3 two of the children improve and recover and one seems much sicker than the rest but appears better on day 4. On day 5 the same child deteriorates and wants to sleep with high fevers, coughing and wheezing. The child is left in bed all day (other adult present babysitting) while the other children go out to pre-planned activities with the father.

On the night of day 5 and early hours of day 6 the child is attended to in the night by the father's partner after coughing causing vomiting. The child is given ventolin and sent back to bed.

On the morning of day 6 the mother is advised by phone that the child was driven to a local hospital by the father after the father awoke to find the child coughing, choking , vomiting and blue in the face and the father's partner attempting to administer ventolin. The mother is told the child has respiratory failure and a collapsed lung. The child is critically ill and deteriorating. Within an hour of arriving at the first local hospital emergency department the child was placed in an induced coma and then transferred to a large city hospital where the child then spent a week in ICU with serious pneumonia. The child recovers and is discharged back into the mother's care.

The father says he did all things necessary and possible to take care of the child. This did not include getting any medical assessment of the child prior to the child being rushed to hospital on what was reported to be day 6 of the illness although the other children said they became unwell several days prior.

How do you feel about sending these children back interstate for further holidays? I feel heartsick but am keen to hear others opinions.
 

Philly2020

Well-Known Member
27 April 2018
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Are there any orders in place? If not, do not send them back at all. If there is, seek legal advice immediately. There a clear arguement for neglect here.
 
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AllEars

Active Member
22 September 2019
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Hi Philly, thank-you for your response, I've been a fan of yours after a lot of reading on this site. Yes, there are temporary orders in place which allow for time as agreed between the parties. The father denies that he handled the situation anything other than appropriately. I know if the situation was reversed I would be considering every possible way I could learn from the experience and work out how I could have let the situation get that bad...ie I would have blamed myself. In reality I would have had him to the doctor within the first 24-48 hours and followed up if he didn't improve. The very idea of sending our kids back makes me sick with worry. I just wanted to be sure I didn't somehow have clouded judgement as it was a frightening and traumatising experience especially for our little boy and we are all still recovering. I have been taking time to ensure that my decision to refuse to send them is well founded and not a knee jerk reaction. Our little boy says he just wanted daddy to know what to do.
 

AllEars

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22 September 2019
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By the way I cannot for the life of me work out if you can and how to send a personal message to another member. I am new to using this site and technologically challenged. Can anyone answer if and how for me?
 

Tremaine

Well-Known Member
5 February 2019
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So, dad of three kids (ie this isn’t his first rodeo) saw the symptoms of a common cold and treated them accordingly with ventolin, bed rest and presumably paracetemol. Two of his kids got better, so he assumed the third probably just needed an extra or two. Then, when his symptoms got worse, dad took him to the hospital.

Sounds like dad did everything any normal parent would do, so how is this neglect?

What happened is unfortunate and frightening and I’m glad your son is recovering, but have some perspective. Does the state remove every child hospitalised with pneumonia from their parents? Or just the ones that don’t visit the GP in the days preceding? Is every parent who brings their child to the hospital with pneumonia guilty of neglect because they treated for a common cold first?
 
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sammy01

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27 September 2015
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So based on the info provided? This is a one off... Yep bad parenting, sure but not neglect especially if it is a one off and not an established history of poor parenting choices.

I'm willing to bet the other parent will be a bit more diligent as a result, but this is not reason to withold.
 
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AllEars

Active Member
22 September 2019
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Thanks Sammy01, I'm a long time fan of yours too. I like your no nonsense style (haha even if it is abrasive at times). I only wish it was a one off. And we've had experience with a child falling ill like this before only I got medical intervention earlier so it didn't get to this degree so I would have thought that experience would have served as a reminder. If a kid gets sick, quite sick then shows some sign of improvement before deteriorating again it's a sure sign medical help is needed.
 

Atticus

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6 February 2019
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Thoughts.... One off or not, kids get sick & it can happen under anybody's watch... The whole family got sick & eventually came good. There was probably no reason to believe that this child would be any different... You were not there after all

Did the attending doctors & staff at the hospital feel the need to report this as a case of negligence under their mandatory reporting criteria?.. If so you may have grounds to suggest there was some negligence, otherwise a child getting sick, even seriously, is not in itself a reason to withhold contact, which in itself would not be without some negative psychological effect on the children..

I'm guessing both the father & his partner have also found this quite traumatic & have beaten themselves up a bit over it even if they have chosen to not let you see it.... Poor form on your part to use this kind of an incident to withhold IMO & quite likely the opinion of the court as well...
 
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sammy01

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27 September 2015
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It's called hyper-vigilence. See back in the day, when my boys got hurt, bruised, dirty, tired, angry the ex determined it was bad parenting... Same thing happened when they were with her? just boys being boys...

That said, all fun and game, after all nobody nearly died.

But let's take a pause.... The kids spend how many days a year with dad?

And you're at interim? Are you self representing?
If you're using a solicitor I'd be wanting them to know about it and take their advice, you've already mentioned that you've got concerms about dad's mental health and capacity to parent...

Short version, this alone is no grounds to withold. This on top of some other concerns is. But I would never ever recommend witholding a child based on my advice. I'd recommend witholding once someone in authority such as a Doc's case worker directs you to withold so you don't run the risk of looking like you're alienating the other parent.
 
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sammy01

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27 September 2015
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oops, just had another read - why are the interim orders 'by agreement'?
Look that does mean you can withold because there is no order stipulating you must send them. But you still need to ask how that is gonna look in court. BTW are you the parent that moved away?